Liesel Teen (0s):

So biggest tip, get a baby wrap or a baby carrier and keep that baby just on you all the time. Sometimes the older that they get, they struggle with the carrier, but most newborn babies are going to be totally fine on you all the time.

Katie Ferraro (12s):

Hey, there I'm Katie Ferraro, registered dietitian, college nutrition, professor and mama seven specializing in baby led weaning here on the baby led weaning made easy podcast. I help you strip out all of the noise and nonsense about feeding, leading you with the competence and knowledge you need to give your baby a safe start to solid foods using baby led weaning. Well, he got it. And welcome back today's Episode is for the moms who are doing baby led, weaning, but are also pregnant. How do you juggle back to back babies when you're pregnant and starting solids with your baby?

Katie Ferraro (53s):

Now I know some of you have your kids really close together. I have my kids super close together. We had seven kids, three and under at 1.2 sets of multiple set of quadruplets set of twins, total pandemonium, absolute chaos. It's not easy juggling babies. And my guest today knows that more than anyone. I am so excited that Liesel teen is with us. She's @mommylabornurse. I know a lot of you guys might know her and follow ser. She is a registered nurse. She's the founder of mommy labor nurse. Her goal is to educate and empower moms in the online space about the birth process. And so what we're talking about today are some particulars for this interesting situation where you find yourself pregnant, but you're also starting solids with your baby, or it may be you have a baby transitioning into toddlerhood.

Katie Ferraro (1m 43s):

What are the things you need to be focusing on in order to make sure you can take care of yourself, take care of the baby, take care of the baby to be she's got some great tips. So with no further ado, let's dive in to learning about how to do it when you're pregnant and starting solids juggling back to back babies with mommy labor nurse Liesel Teen RN. Well, hi, Liesel thank you so much for joining me on the podcast.

Liesel Teen (2m 9s):

I'm so happy to be here.

Katie Ferraro (2m 11s):

This is so exciting because I have gotten to be on your podcast and tell my story. And now I would love it. If you could just introduce yourself, tell us your story and how it is that you came to be known as mommy labor nurse.

Liesel Teen (2m 24s):

Yeah, so let's see, let's go back. About four years. I have been a labor and delivery nurse for longer than four years, but I was a nurse I worked in the emergency department, always wanted to do labor and delivery, got into labor and delivery and worked for a couple of years on night shift, got pregnant with my first son who he's four and a half now and went back to work about three months postpartum. It's how it is here in the United States. Just typical, you know, three month maternity leave came back working almost full time. And I love job as a labor and delivery nurse, but every day that I would leave, I was like, oh, I want to just stay home with my baby.

Liesel Teen (3m 6s):

I wish I could drop to part-time. So I could, you know, stay home with my baby a little bit more. And our situation was like, you know, I kind of needed to work as much as I needed to work for financial sake. So I was like, okay, is there any way I can do something part-time on the side so I could drop my status a little bit so I can stay home with my baby. So I got to kind of thinking I did full-time for almost we call it three quarter time. I did that until he was about eight months old. And then I did drop to part-time started to kind of think about blogging at that point. Didn't have any idea, even what I wanted to blog about, but got the idea that, you know, I wanted to blog about something and then it just kind of hit me.

Liesel Teen (3m 48s):

And I was like, duh, I'm a labor and delivery nurse. Like, that's a perfect idea. I'm a labor and delivery nurse and a mom. And there's all these mom blogs out there, like why not have a labor and delivery nurse mom book. So I got to thinking about it started a Pinterest page, started a website. It looked way different than it does now. I wasn't even called mommy labor nurse back then. I was, it was a completely different name, but I started it, launched it when he was about a year. So I took a couple months to kind of get it going. And then he was about a year and I was part-time I think still at that point. And you know, I just kind of did my thing, started writing articles. I was really into writing articles and doing stuff on Pinterest and I had an Instagram page at that point, but again, it looked very, very different than it does now.

Liesel Teen (4m 35s):

I wasn't even called mommy labor nurse. I would post about trying to kind of be like one of those lifestyle kind of pages. And, you know, sometimes I would throw something labor and delivery in there, but it was just very, not organized, very like kind of all over the place. And then a few months after that, about six months later, I started getting a little bit more into Instagram marketing and how to make my page a little bit more cohesive. I took a course on that. So I changed my brand to mommy labor nurse. I started to change the way that I take pictures. And luckily, so this is something that a lot of people don't know about me unless they follow me very closely or kind of have been following me way back when, but my dad is actually a professional photographer and he's retired now, but he was a professional wedding photographer in the nineties, you know, when I was growing up and he did children's or photography.

Liesel Teen (5m 27s):

So in my childhood house, which I live about 10 minutes from now, he has like a big studio that has a big white backdrop. And he has all this knowledge of photography.

Katie Ferraro (5m 37s):

Wow, you are so lucky.

Liesel Teen (5m 41s):

So I got this idea. So I was like, you know, dad can help me take pictures of and use to take pictures. So I started off taking pictures in my parents studio. My dad took a lot of my pictures in the beginning and it's kind of funny if you realize that if you've looked back at some of my very early pictures of like me, you know, pretending to like push a baby out or like doing this really weird face and I'll get comments from people being like,

Katie Ferraro (6m 4s):

You're your wn medical actor. I love it. Exactly. I'm my own style.

Liesel Teen (6m 8s):

Yeah. I put that on my story too. But before of like, these are funny stock pictures of Liezel like, I take all these different kinds of like poses and stuff, but it's funny. Cause I'll have comments saying like, you know, have a post that's an embarrassing post or something and someone's like, does your dad Take that picture? And I'm like, yeah,

Katie Ferraro (6m 27s):

that's awesome.

Liesel Teen (6m 28s):

So he's great. I mean, so it just kind of evolved from there. I started doing more things. Now I have a podcast. Now the website looks

Katie Ferraro (6m 36s):

completely different now that we are launching a third birth course in a couple of weeks. So it's just kind of growing. What are the birth courses that you currently have? Because I didn't meet you until I was done having babies, but I'm still obsessed with all your content, but I,

Liesel Teen (6m 52s):

Yeah, so right now we have two different ones right now at birth it up the natural series and birth it up the epidural series and the natural series is a prenatal course for someone who is a little bit more interested in going unmedicated, natural kind of, you know, wants to avoid an epidural if possible. But I still talk about epidurals in that course, just in case, you know, you change your mind midway. We be, which happens, upsell

Katie Ferraro (7m 16s):

Them into the epidural series. If they decide the natural routes out the way. Well, no, it's

Liesel Teen (7m 21s):

Not like I'm pitching, Hey, take this one too. I also add tidbits of like, okay, this is like, what is actually sort of like to get an epidural? You know, the epidural course is really just for someone who knows. I definitely want an epidural, but I also want birth education. So cool. Talk to me like I know that I'm going to get an epidural. And in that one, I also have a section that is, oops, excellently went natural. Like what the heck do I do? Because that situation happens too, where you go too quickly for your epidural and then there's all this trauma because you thought you were going to get an epidural and then you go a little bit too fast.

Katie Ferraro (7m 55s):

So how do you take a class if you are like, if you intended to go epidural and then you ended up having natural, do they take the course after to see like for recovery, what they do in postpartum?

Liesel Teen (8m 6s):

No. So we recommend taking it before. So the reason why we kind of cross them is because yeah, we have people who have had plenty of people take any epidural series knowing, okay. Knowing I want to get an epidural, but also going over this section of like, oops, here's like some tips if this situation happens and how to get through it. Cool. So we recommend definitely that you take it before and we've had lots of moms, not lots and lots of moms, but a fair amount of moms say, I'm so glad that I took that little section. So I had some tips because I did go so fast and I was planning on an epidural, but I didn't get one. So I'm so glad that I at least knew of like some tips of how to get through this experience.

Liesel Teen (8m 50s):

So

Katie Ferraro (8m 51s):

I know on our podcast, the majority of the moms listening have babies who are just starting solids at six, 12 months of age, but we have a huge contingency. And we just realized this recently we did a bunch of market research that are still pregnant and learning about baby led, weaning, which I'm like, how are you that organized props to you? That's awesome. But a lot of people just like, I just want all the knowledge now before I have the baby and like, yeah, I get it. But also a lot of moms who just had a baby and they're before the age of starting solids. So they're between zero to six months. And I know you have a newborn basics class that might be of interest to them as well. So could you maybe just share a little bit about that program?

Liesel Teen (9m 25s):

So that's our third one that we have right now. So that is for someone who we actually recommend people taking that one right before they have their baby or soon thereafter, because that is exactly what it sounds like. It teaches you on newborn basic care. So the reason that I made that course was actually because of COVID because there are those baby care one-on-one classes that you can take from the hospital. It teaches you about diapering and bathing and newborn characteristics and what to look for and schedules and like all of this kind of stuff that typically it's an in-person class where you go it's, you know, you take your partner, that sort of thing. But a lot of these classes got canceled because of COVID.

Liesel Teen (10m 5s):

So there were no online option. So I said, okay, you know what? I feel well enough to make an online version myself.

Katie Ferraro (10m 12s):

So, which I think is awesome. Like, yeah, parents need that because I'll tell you a funny story. When I had my oldest son, you know, my birth story, I had one Singleton like normal vaginal delivery, like a normal person. And then how I had quadruplets, which was obviously a planned C-section, that was at 34 weeks. Then I had a set of twins a year and a half later. And that was a planned C-section at 38 weeks. But with my oldest, when we were in the hospital, like I had, I mean, it was fine, like nothing interesting about the birthing experience, except like the day after they rang a bell in the hospital and like come to the new parent class, like on the floor. And I remember going there and you're like are pushing the bassinet and you can like kind of not walk. And my husband's there. And like, I remember my baby was crying and the lady was like, oh, if you want to pick your baby up and wrap your baby.

Katie Ferraro (10m 57s):

And I didn't like, she's like, why don't you swaddle your baby? And I was like, I don't know what that is. Like, like, I don't even know it's not number feet. I was like, dang, I've been a mom for like five minutes. And I already feel like, I don't know what I'm doing. And it was like kind of embarrassing because I was like, oh my God, all of these people have taken some sort of course that I didn't. Cause all these babies were like wrapped like burritos. And then I realized the nurse just showed them how to do it. And you can totally ask. But like, I feel like if I had just known a little bit ahead of time, like, oh, swaddling is important. And you know, I was like, God, it looks painful. Just some of those things to even be aware of as a new mom, I remember just feeling like I was like a deer in the headlights. I'm like, oh my God, the baby's crying and I'm bothering everyone. I don't know how to swaddle. And I don't know what swaddling is like. Yeah. Just being aware of this stuff in a class can be so helpful.

Katie Ferraro (11m 37s):

I think.

Liesel Teen (11m 37s):

Yeah. That is also true of baby led weaning. I'm sure. Like I know that it's way more beneficial to, and that's, what's the nice thing about online courses too, is like, you can take it kind of beforehand and then you have access to it when you're actually going through. Exactly.

Katie Ferraro (11m 52s):

Because there is nothing like going through the, and it, but also it would be nice to know what to expect, but I gotta be honest. I wouldn't, my husband, I went to a, like a full day hospital course with our first baby and yeah. I have like a very short attention span to begin with. And like at lunchtime I'm like, dude, we have to leave because I looked at the agenda and after lunch, the entire agenda, they literally should have just called it. Everything that could go wrong. It was like, oh, If you have a vaginal tear and if this happens Or that happens, I'm like, I don't want to sit here and hear about all the things that can go wrong. So I think, yeah, we do sometimes run the risk of over educating where then you just think about all these things that can go wrong. And obviously in your field, you know, like anybody who's had a baby and sees that you're pregnant, feels obligated to tell you the worst possible story about their birth.

Katie Ferraro (12m 34s):

Like, what is it about me that said, I want to hear like your traumatic birth story. Like no, thank you. Yeah.

Liesel Teen (12m 39s):

No, totally agree. And that's another advantage to online courses versus like being somewhere in person. Because if for some reason, this subject that I have in the online course is triggering. You don't want to go over it. You can just skip it. You can't really skip in person unless, unless like you did, you literally skip it and walk out

Katie Ferraro (12m 58s):

Or he was like, we're leaving. And I was like, he was like, what if we miss something? And I was like, I know A lot of moms have this, but like I bought him all these like books about fatherhood. And I was reading like everything about, you know, your baby is the size of a peach today, that sort of stuff. And I had bought him like a fatherhood wedding. Like you haven't even touched it. And he's like, I feel like when it happens, I'm just going to let my instincts kick in. And it's like, actually he was so under prepared. But like, it was the best thing ever because like we figured it out as we went, you know? Yeah, totally. And then like now he has seven kids, but he's like, he's like people ask him specific questions. He's like, I don't remember. Like, I'm like, I remember every single moment like ask me, but like the dads don't always remember the details.

Liesel Teen (13m 34s):

No, they don't. And they don't even, like I asked my husband the other day, we were talking about my older one versus my little one, like when they kind of started sleeping through the night and my husband remembers my little one sleeping through the night when he was about three months old, which is about the time that I transitioned him to his room. And he still occasionally would wake up. I mean, he was doing better than my, than my little one, but I was like, no, there were still times that I went up there. Like he was not sleeping through them.

Katie Ferraro (14m 5s):

You don't remember. I know you have to go back and look at my old Instagram posts, especially for feeding schedules because parents like, you know, I remember some of them, but you have to write it down because you know, every baby's different or what you think you remember. Like, I want to make sure I'm giving accurate information. So, you know, this is just my own experience, but here's what you might expect, especially if multiples that they would do at these different stages. But again, it is only one person's experience, but it doesn't hurt to hear lots of people's experiences. And I'd love to hear, you know, your experiences from your audience and your expertise because a lot of our moms are second time moms. What's interesting about baby led weaning. It's one of the few things that appeals to a second time parent, right? Like, yes, you can sell a first-time mom, anything. They will buy everything from the registry and get all the junk. And you realize like you don't really need that many things to raise the baby healthfully and happily,

Liesel Teen (14m 50s):

I had a NutriBullet baby food that you used for us second, right? Yeah. For my first one, it was like 50 bucks.

Katie Ferraro (14m 56s):

Some people like I just bought this expensive baby food maker. I'm like you realize If you have a pot with a lid on it in water, it does exactly what that $300 thing does.

Liesel Teen (15m 6s):

Yeah. Or if you really don't want to do, like, if you really do want to do puree is like a blender. Like you don't need a baby food maker. That's great.

Katie Ferraro (15m 16s):

But the second time mom was like, wait a minute, hold up. I did traditional spoon-feeding now I've got the picky eating toddler. And there you, there's some degree of pickiness that sets in, in the second year of life for almost all children. But we know with baby led weaning, it can really reduce the severity of the pickiness. And so the second time mom will be interested, like, all right, I'm willing to give this baby led weaning thing, a try, because I don't want to have another picky eater. So I wanted to ask you for the moms that are in that position, like they have a baby and now they're pregnant again. So they might just be starting solids or really getting into the hang of weening. And now they're pregnant again. Are there like physical or physiological changes that they're when you're pregnant back to back like that for those moms that are kind of cramming it all in that they need to be aware of if they're dealing with a baby and pregnant a second time.

Katie Ferraro (16m 2s):

Yeah, for

Liesel Teen (16m 2s):

Sure. So there's a lot of things that come up or may talk about pregnancy and you know, in the first trimester and doing this thing, starting solids, that's a big thing. At least for me, it was with both of my babies. It's like something like you said, you prep for, you start to read about, start to ask questions. This is like a big thing that you do with your baby. So there are a few things that come up. If you find yourself pregnant, newly pregnant, typically if your baby's about six or seven months old, you're probably going to be somewhere in that first trimester. So the first thing that I'm thinking about is issues with morning sickness and throwing up and giving baby foods that maybe you have aversions to.

Liesel Teen (16m 47s):

You're not so cool with, or even issues of like, I feel like I'm going to puke right now, but I don't want to leave my baby in the high chair and go puke because of a safety issue. Like I want to always be with my you're always supposed to be with your baby while you're feeding them. So there's this issue of like being sick? What do I do? So unfortunately with the safety issue, some of the things that I've heard are okay, instead of running to the toilet in a different room, maybe it's a hallway bathroom and you can still have, you know, access right there. Or maybe a lot of people like this is we're getting really east throw up in the sink.

Liesel Teen (17m 28s):

The kitchen sink is right there. You know? I mean, you do what you gotta do. You have a trash can there, if you have the trashcan babies typically, and you probably know better than I do, but I would think older children, adults, like are kind of grossed out when there's someone puking and they're trying to please don't care at all. They just don't get it in their app. Yeah, exactly. So don't worry about that. Okay. Like, unless you're actively throwing up on their plate,

Katie Ferraro (17m 54s):

even then, I mean, that is not gonna be an issue.

Liesel Teen (17m 58s):

Yeah. Sorry to get gross.

Katie Ferraro (17m 59s):

Like many moms are down with them. So they're just like, yeah. I mean, hang on a second. I got to go feed, but yeah, you should never Leave your child unintended to nature. But the reality is you might not feel awesome in the morning. And we know that babies tend to do better in the morning if their first meal is good and they are engaged in their first meal, they tend to have greater participation later in the day. Don't beat yourself up about it. If you're not able to get that baby to the table for breakfast, because you yourself are sick. You can't take care of other people if you're not taking care of yourself. So don't pressure yourself to do this every single day, every single breakfast.

Liesel Teen (18m 28s):

Absolutely not. And that's what brings me to my next point. So the other issue is, yeah, maybe you're not feeling yourself in the morning and maybe you do need some help. Okay. Maybe you have family nearby or you have someone nearby, you have a babysitter, you have your partner to help you. This is a time in your life when he really needs some help. And it's okay to ask for help if you need it. Okay. Maybe that looks like, you know, I would think that a lot of moms, since this is such a big thing that, you know, starting solids with their first baby, you might have feelings of, if someone else's feeding my child, I'm missing out on this experience. So you have, you know, some feelings of like guilt and that's understandable.

Liesel Teen (19m 12s):

Of course, maybe that looks like okay, every day, you know that someone else is feeding my baby, we're doing video. Some, you know, you're taking a video of baby eating so you can see your baby. You can still kind of somewhat, you know, feel involved in the process.

Katie Ferraro (19m 24s):

And the baby's not going to remember. They have very short attention spans and memories. They're not going to remember that you weren't there and you do need to be taking care of yourself. Now, now let's fast forward for the moms like the Irish twin. Like you've got a 10, 11-month-old and you just had a newborn. Now again, you are the expert in all things related to labor and birth. So the skin to skin stuff really recommended for the first few days, two weeks after a mom delivers, especially if she's breastfeeding, if you've got back to back babies, this can be really challenging. If you've got an older infant or toddler is doing solids of baby led weaning, how can a mom prioritize? Cause you feel like you always feel like you're just giving half of yourself to each of the kid, any tips for the postpartum mom.

Liesel Teen (20m 4s):

So hard. I know. So biggest tip, get a baby wrap or a baby carrier and keep that baby just on you all the time. Some babies do better with being wrapped up like that than others. Some babies kind of feel sometimes the older that they get, they struggle with the carrier, but most newborn babies are going to be totally fine on you all the time. So I think that is how the majority of the Irish twin kind of moms do it is they just baby wear all day long and it's okay. And it's perfectly fine, perfectly like amazing for baby because babies right there on your skin. So you do what you gotta do when we're thinking about like, you know, it's going to be even harder if you're recovering from a C-section cause those moms they're in the bed.

Liesel Teen (20m 46s):

So that's more of where you're going to need some help. You, you need your partner to be helping with older child. You need, you know, someone coming a babysitter or a family member needing much more help. So again, don't be afraid to ask for help. This is the time that you need it and it's perfectly fine and don't feel guilty about it at all.

Katie Ferraro (21m 8s):

I remember when my twins were born, they were 38 weeks. I had a scheduled C-section, but the recovery was so much harder because I had quadruplet one and a half year old and a two-and-a-half year old Singleton. So it's like not the actual baby that you just had. That is so hard. It's the ones that came before it and trying to manage their expectations. And I literally remember like locking myself in my room and my husband's like, what are they supposed to have for lunch? And I was like, ah, I feel like you can figure it out. Like, yeah. Cause you know, they wanted to jump on your stomach and play with the babies. And it was like, I couldn't get up and make food for them. And for that period, like we probably didn't eat the most nutritious food ever. And you know what, it's totally fine. And they live to talk about it. It's not the end of the world.

Liesel Teen (21m 44s):

And another big tip is ease of use. So when we talk about, and this is your subject more than it is mine, but something that I know can really, really help is like, if you need to get cut up watermelon versus like a big giant watermelon, like yeah, go for it. Pay the extra $3. It's okay. It's going to make your life way, way easier. Lean

Katie Ferraro (22m 5s):

Into the convenience foods. Exactly. I agree. I'm not going to cut up the pineapple if I just had a C-section, but if we're trying the new food today is pineapple and some of this, you kind of can plan ahead of time. And again, you know, I know a lot of the moms listening are super planners, so yeah, we certainly can lean into some of those food preparation techniques or to batch cook. And I love that you mentioned the importance of accepting help, especially when people offer to make you food. Like, I feel like now people are like, oh, I'm just going to send you, you know, grub hub or whatever, which is also super nice. But I think people still, like, if you say yes that you'd be willing to try a dish that your friend makes, there's probably something in that that your baby could eat as well. And it has a little more sodium than usual. It's again, it's not the end of the world.

Katie Ferraro (22m 48s):

It's okay. You need to be nourishing your body to mom. And I think sometimes we focus so much on our kids and what are they going to eat? It's like, well, what are you going to eat? You think about that first. And then let's modify that to make it something that the baby can eat as well.

Liesel Teen (22m 60s):

Yeah. And a lot of times what I hear too is something that's really good as like something one-handed so maybe like a burrito or a sandwich that you can just hold with one hand because you'll learn very quickly that like having one baby, you learn how to do stuff with one hand, but like having two babies, it's like even, okay, this is like a skill that I've mastered and I need to really, really master it with two babies. So one handed foods also very, very helpful.

Katie Ferraro (23m 26s):

Well, that's what I got governed. My oldest, I never really did baby carriers. Cause there's only one baby at a time. But once you have multiples, I was like, I mean, I know all of the benefits of babywearing, but I was not interested in any of them. It was the hands-free thing. I'm like, wait a minute. If I figure this out and this feels snug and secure and that I have both my hands back, I can take care of my other kids that need my help right now as well. Like that was a huge incentive. And I think it is a lot of parents. Like you need both of your hands to parent and if you're pumping on top of it, like it's crazy,

Liesel Teen (23m 53s):

Dude. Yeah. And that brings up another one too, is okay. If you're pumping for some reason, let's do some education on pumping and how to be the most effective pumper that you can. Cause there's a lot of, I mean, you know, there's like a lot of things out there that you can buy that you can do to make pumping a little bit easier, but yeah, pumping, having a newborn and having maybe a 10 or 11 month old is hard. So I would also say if like set your expectations low and don't feel guilty if you can't meet that pumping goal or that breastfeeding goal. I have one friend in particular who she knew, okay, I'm going to try breastfeeding, but I know that he was 12 and a half months.

Liesel Teen (24m 37s):

I think when her second one was born and I'm going to try breastfeeding. But if it doesn't work out, I'm not going to beat myself up for it because I literally have a 12 and a half month old and a little tiny baby. So if that is your situation, it's perfectly okay. Breastfeeding is great. Breast milk is great, but happy mom is even better. So

Katie Ferraro (24m 57s):

I think as far as the, I always exclusively pumped for all seven of my kids and with the twins, I had a friend come over and she had twins exactly. One year older than mine to the day. And she showed me how to tandem breastfeed. And she gave me the pillow and I was like, I will try this because it like literally was making her feel better. But I'm like, I have no intention of tandem feeding these with, because I had five toddlers also. But I was like all pump all day long. I freaking love pumping. I think it's like a vacation Break to this day. Actually, my brother loves to make fun of me Because he used to be like, you know, you would say you would go pumping. You be gone for like an hour and I'd be watching all your kids and the other day, and my kids are like five and six now. And I said to him, hang on, can you watch these guys for a second? I'm going to go pump. And he was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then he realized like, wait a minute, you don't even have babies anymore.

Katie Ferraro (25m 36s):

I'm like, no, I still use The excuse. Like nobody who's going to call you out. I think that saved my life was, and I was pumping before all of these like cool, newer hands-free pump, things like this is like, you had a cord attached to you, which I like, you had to take a 15 minute break. Sure. It was every other hour. But like you should sit down and just do one thing. Like I would just read a book, but the hands-free pumping bra whenever I see someone holding the flanges, I'm like, dude, you know, they make a bra for this. Like you really don't need to have your hands involved. Like this broad does everything for you. And that's probably, you know, when you order something on Amazon, it's like, you last ordered this or you've ordered this, like the hands-free pumping brides. Like you've ordered this 17 times. Cause I get it for every single friend. So I'm like, I saw you holding it with your hands.

Katie Ferraro (26m 18s):

Did you not know about the hands-free pumping bra? Yeah, I know.

Liesel Teen (26m 21s):

I remember doing that for one of my friends too, like going over to her house, newly postpartum and she was sitting there and I'm like, dude, like, dude, let me send you a hands-free pump. Like, you know, those things exist. Right. It's like, wait, what? I don't have to like, hold these things here. No, absolutely not. So yeah, totally agree with you. The hands-free pumping is awesome. And I do agree with you that like having the cord and going into a separate can be so, so beneficial, especially someone like you who had multiples, who like that break is you almost like need that break. So in contrast, I was the kind of person where I'm like trying to do all these things at once. And the stimulation was like almost too much for me at times.

Liesel Teen (27m 3s):

And it's like, I'm too overwhelmed. And yeah, I wonder if I had just done that with each pumping session, it would have been better, but again, not everybody's in that situation, you know, sometimes you have to. I know,

Katie Ferraro (27m 14s):

But I think we can like, just like we encourage parents to make a peaceful yep. Or try to create a stress free feeding environment. Like it's not, if you have a toddler or another child and a dog and a, a TV, like there's a lot of distractions, but you can make some adjustments to make that a less stressful eating environment. Same thing goes with pumping. I used to remember how like serene and quiet the pumping room at the NICU was. And I was like, okay, my house is not like this, but I could do a few things to make it like a little bit more quiet, a little bit more calm, like a little bit less stressful when I pumped. And I really did try to like use it. It was literally my only time alone was like as a time to take a break. And I think, you know, you need to obviously take care of yourself. And I know we throw the term self-care around a lot, but you can make these small adjustments to make it a more peaceful experience for yourself, which is you're going to be more enjoying it.

Katie Ferraro (28m 0s):

If it's a less stressful experience and more likely to stay with it. And same thing about feeding Here making more. But my parents Were like, wait, sit down three times a day and eat with my baby. Yeah. You should be sitting down three times a day and feeding yourself. So when you're doing that, let's talk about how we can involve the baby. But some of these parents like, oh, I never sit down and eat. Well, we maybe need to look at your schedule because you're now sharing mealtimes with your baby. If you never stop and feed yourself, sorry, someone needs to stop and feed the baby. So you should be eating with them. Yeah.

Liesel Teen (28m 28s):

We're also giving off a good, like, okay, if your baby always sees you getting up, running around to eat, maybe they're going to think that that's just a normal thing.

Katie Ferraro (28m 36s):

Right? The last thing you want is a toddler that runs around and goes through the roof. Dude, keep them in that chair. He's eating a high chair, toddlers eating a high chair. Yeah,

Liesel Teen (28m 45s):

Totally. One other thing I thought about too, when you were talking about pumping and making it easier is, or making it less stressful is they actually have some meditations on some of the meditation apps for pumping moms. And there's one that I listened to a lot and it was actually supposed to help with milk supply. And it involved, you like tensing up and releasing at certain points. It's very, very cool. There's a lot of like, we're trying to make pumping a lot less stressful, like a lot easier and a lot less stressful. So that's a good tip too. Is if you're in a meditation, look at some of those meditation apps, sometimes they're specifically for pumping moms. That's interesting.

Katie Ferraro (29m 19s):

I never thought about that. I know like the whole, like making pumping less stressful. The only people who say that they like, I feel like pumping is awesome. Especially if you have multiples, I loved it because I was never going to be able to breastfeed quadruplets. Like I didn't even want to set myself up for that. I had tried to latch and stuff, but I was like, what am I doing here? Like, what's my end goal here. Like, I don't want to just breastfeed one. And, but I remember people who say, oh, I hate pumping. I'm like, it's always the people who are good at breastfeeding who the Liberty to say, oh, I hate pumping. It's like, well, yeah, cause you have an alternative. You actually know how to breastfeed or it's working for you. I'm not doing this because I want to, I either like physiologically can't or like psychologically, can't like, I understand the importance of breast milk, but I wanted to ask you about how when we asked for help.

Katie Ferraro (29m 59s):

I mean, I think we're ignoring the elephant in the room is that for most of the moms who are newly postpartum, there is in many cases, another partner there, a another parent. Now obviously we have moms that are doing this solo and more power to them. But if you do have a partner, they sometimes don't know how to ask for help. How can we without destroying our relationship, but in the postpartum state, when you know, hormones are crazy and sleep schedules are off, like what are some tips that you have for asking your partner to help out as you're trying to be feeding one baby and taking care of another one?

Liesel Teen (30m 38s):

Yeah. So communication Like clear As humanly possible. I know, I barely know the answer to because like we still struggle with this, but our marriage therapist tells us that communication. Right. Okay. That goes back to everything. So I often find myself thinking in my head, I wish my husband would do this. I wish my husband would do that, but not actually saying it out loud. And when I say things out loud, they actually get done. There's no like, well, I don't want to do that. It's literally a matter of like, whether I just clearly communicate with my husband on getting on this, that, and the other, I need help with this. My life is a lot less stressful.

Liesel Teen (31m 19s):

So work on communication skills. This is a piece in one of my courses too. It's a newborn basics of like things, conversations to have with your partner before baby comes, because that's a huge disruption that almost all parents face of like transition from going with it's just us. And we're having, you know, fights that involve just us. And now we're having fights that involve baby and there's issues with communication. So

Katie Ferraro (31m 47s):

Toddler or another baby and a

Liesel Teen (31m 49s):

Toddler or another baby. Yes, exactly. It's a lot. So definitely going back to communication, having those conversations, if you're still pregnant, having those conversations before even baby arrives, what are some things also that you like, or you're good at about, you know, what's going on in your day? Like if you're the kind of person like I'm thinking about somebody who's newly postpartum and I really do like to make breakfast for my kids. Like I like being in control of that. I don't like to offer that to my husband. Like I don't like to ask him for that, but you know what? I don't like, like cleaning my kid up or, you know, cleaning up the floor, which, I mean, let's be honest.

Liesel Teen (32m 30s):

Like that's probably most people like the making versus like the cleaning up, but I'm way more apt to like ask my husband for that sort of help. And I feel like I'm, you know, we're more of a team because I like doing that. He doesn't care either way. So looking at the, some of the tasks that you like versus your husband or your partner likes, and who's better at what my husband's definitely a way better cook when it comes to dinner. So he likes to cook dinner more. So it's like, you know, weighing like those daily tasks and those family tasks and seeing what works and seeing what doesn't and giving yourself grace of like, okay, we might think this is how the routine is going to go, but once baby's here, one second, baby's here.

Liesel Teen (33m 11s):

Wow. This is not what we anticipated. And we need to like, flip-flop or I need to do this and you need to do this and it's okay. We just need to figure it out. And also realizing that you're in the thick of it. Like I have to still remind my husband and have that, like we have a four year old and a 10 month old. And like, we're still just in the thick of it. Like, this is a hard time. It's not over. It's not over. Exactly. Okay.

Katie Ferraro (33m 33s):

My tip for parents when they don't know how to ask for help or for moms, rather, I know for my husband, he's like not great in the kitchen. If I was like, make a lasagna, like, I don't want to see it. Like, it would be a big mess, but whatever parents struggle with how to safely feed their babies meat. And yet dads have a tendency. Like the only thing that a lot of dads care about and baby led weaning is like do to that baby. Just eat pork. Like that's so cool. Yeah. Okay. Here's the pork shoulder. Could you please make this into some sort of soft shreddable pork that might can the baby in strips? Like he can do that. He loves it and it's like, I don't even like making meat. So there you go. Yeah. You just made an important high iron food with a new texture for the baby to try and I didn't have to do it. And also when you make a pork shoulder, you make like a lot of it.

Katie Ferraro (34m 15s):

So then you save all the extras and you can freeze it. Then you don't have to make pork every day. Right. So go with what they might be interested in or good at. Like, he doesn't care about avocados, but the second the baby's going to eat lamb. He's like, that's pretty cool. So maybe if you have a dad was just twiddling his thumbs looking for something to do, give him a hug, a meet and tell them how to make it safe for baby led weaning. And he can be involved in feeding your family as well.

Liesel Teen (34m 36s):

Totally. Okay. My husband does the same thing. I mean, I remember when my first one, he realized that like, oh wow, he's not just drinking milk. Like he's actually eating food. Like I can actually prepare food for him. Like this is so cool. Like, I feel so much more, you know, cause he's like used to me being the sole provider of nutrition of, you know, breastfeeding. And now it's like, oh wow, this is like this whole new thing where I can actually get involved and I can actually prepare foods. So yeah. Very

Katie Ferraro (35m 5s):

Cool. Well Liesel, thank you so much for your time. It's been a pleasure chatting with you as always tell us where we can find you on the internet to learn more about everything before, during and after giving birth. Yes. So

Liesel Teen (35m 17s):

Most people know me as @mommy.labornurse on Instagram, there is q eo5 in there. So it's mommy dot labor nurse on Instagram post every day and do Q and A's on the weekends. We talk about labor, birth pregnancy, postpartum, breastfeeding, all that good stuff. So that's where I am on Instagram. And then my course is all of my other cool things are on my website: mommylabornurse.com. And then I also have a podcast which is just the mommy labor nurse podcast. And we talk about Katie, you were on it

Katie Ferraro (35m 45s):

. So Katie's episode just came out this week. So there's lots of cool episodes on there where I dive into lots of other motherhood type things, birth stories and expert interviews and Q and A's and just there's all types of episodes.

Liesel Teen (35m 59s):

So. Awesome. Well, thank you so much for being here. This was so much fun. Yeah. Thanks for having me.

Katie Ferraro (36m 6s):

Well, I hope you guys enjoyed that interview with Liesel Teen R N. She's on Instagram @mommy.labornurse. Amazing information about, I love her birth it up course. So she's got a natural series in an epidural series. She's got a newborn basics class, tons of great content for you on her Instagram page as well. And also her mommy labor nurse podcast is a really great resource as well. So for those of you who are figuring out baby led weaning when you're pregnant or maybe you want to do it for your second baby, cause you did traditional spoon-feeding with your first and you're looking for a better alternative, go check out Liesel Teens info, I'll link, everything that she talked about in today's episode on the show notes for this episode, which you can find@blwpodcast.com.

Katie Ferraro (36m 49s):

Thank you so much for listening. See you next time.